Ron Bechet is a painter, printmaker, and Chairman of Xavier University’s Art department.
Courtney Egan is a filmmaker and new media artist who curates film programs consisting of local artists’ film and video work.
Allen Eskew is Director of the architecture and design firm Eskew+Dumez+Ripple.
Joy Glidden is Director of Louisiana Artworks, an educational center and cultural incubator for visual artists and the New Orleans community set to open this spring.

(Left to right:) Ron Bechet, Courtney Egan, Allen Eskew, Joy Glidden |
Nick Stillman: Something that’s become immediately apparent from speaking with artists here is how radically the storm has altered their practices. On a pragmatic level, the destruction of so much of the city’s architecture has almost created a post-studio situation out of necessity. Courtney, let’s start with you. Has there been a before-and-after effect on your work?
Courtney Egan: Definitely. I was doing work that was about—it’s hard to explain just because I haven’t done it in so long—the psychology of stardom. A lot of it involved images of the female body and the media—taking body parts of different stars and putting them together.
NS: Like The Chaos Hags video from 2003?
CE: Yeah. But after the storm I felt that this work wasn’t important to me anymore. I started doing two different things; collecting film and video work of other people and organizing programs to show around the country. My personal work became much more landscape-based, but still utilizing video and objects together.
NS: Landscape-based because nature and weather felt so much more relevant?
CE: Yeah, I thought a lot more about how they affect everything in our life here and how we’re totally at the behest of whatever the weather decides to do.
NS: Ron, you’ve been making landscape-based work for quite some time. Has your work changed in the wake of the storm?
Ron Bechet: Yeah, it has. My work has always been about issues of leaving and returning or life and death; issues broader than here and now. I think it affirms what I was doing, but it’s become difficult to find my path in my studio, by myself. I used to work long hours by myself dealing with my own issues and how they relate to others. Now I find that—I won’t say ridiculous, but—not as rewarding as working with other people.

Ron Bechet
Search for Justice (2007)
Charcoal on paper
|
NS: Allen, architects and designers almost always have to work with other people, so I assume collaboration has remained constant. How has your practice changed since the storm?
Allen Eskew: My firm had arrived at the point where we were a design-focused studio as far as the spectrum of architects go. That’s where we were. The storm hit, and I felt our firm needed to stand up and be fully engaged. The work changed immediately; it became planning, community outreach, and participatory design. For so many years we were focused on beautiful objects. Then the scale shifted and architecture and design became a healing process where the essence of the individual object was secondary or tertiary to the act of a bigger plan.
NS: Process became much more important.
AE: Yeah. I was doing facility and community planning six days a week and the process became almost like group therapy. Actually, toward the end of it I realized that architecture and planning was becoming a performance art because I was performing it at times in front of a hurt, grieving, sometimes hostile crowd. Part of the performance was having a meeting to advance the planning process and at the end of the performance, we hoped the people gained acknowledge of what the subject matter was, perhaps allowing them to see their battered neighborhood more optimistically. Because of the nature of the storm and the political abdication of responsibility, people were empowered to design their own neighborhoods. It has altered my practice fundamentally.
NS: Do you expect this will be a sustained and lasting phenomenon as it relates to your practice?
AE: I hope not, and that’s not to be negative. After working so long at making buildings, I don’t want this federal flood to be the reason I had to alter careers. I see myself expanding my ability, but I do eventually want to get out of the war zone of community planning and get back into making select objects.
NS: Joy, as the director of Louisiana Artworks you have this building with amazing facilities for all different types of artists. The upcoming opening of the center in the spring seems like a real opportunity for some sustained positivity and development in New Orleans’ contemporary art community. How have you worked to establish trust and relationships with New Orleans artists?

Louisiana Artworks
Interior view |
Joy Glidden: When I first came here I got involved with the cultural component of Unified New Orleans Plans’ plan and the contemporary visual art community became my focus. I started to do convening sessions with the artist community—including Courtney and Ron—and we’re still doing those once every couple of months. When I first started the sessions there was much more of a need and sense of relief that the group had been brought together. Now there are a lot of people doing a lot of things feeding into this sense of contemporary visual art community. My role was to just bring artists together to dialogue and express need lists and express how they felt about art institutions, how they existed pre-Katrina, and how they could help them post-Katrina. After that I did a strategic plan and an assessment of the arts institutions here. Some of the things we’re doing now at Louisiana Artworks are based on those findings.
NS: What were some of the artists’ needs you discovered?
JG: Studio space is a big issue. There are no small or mid-sized exhibition spaces in New Orleans that are nonprofit. At Louisiana Artworks we’ll have a video and media exhibition space, which is currently non-existent in New Orleans. Those are the really big things. The other thing that I developed is the Association of Contemporary Visual Arts New Orleans, which will address the findings of artists’ need lists and gave those findings to the New Orleans Museum of Art, the Contemporary Art Center (CAC), the Ogden Museum, and the Arts Council of New Orleans. Institutions are being confronted by their constituency so they can understand a little better what artists’ needs are.
NS: Ron, from the point of view of an artist, what are the most urgent needs of artists in New Orleans right now?
RB: I guess the most urgent need is a place to come together. And the “opportunity” of the storm has brought us together—more or less out of necessity. I think another need is studio space. It’s something we’re all struggling with. Personally, my studio was destroyed.
NS: It’s interesting how tragedy can make people open up to each other and talk more and share more. I guess if there’s anything positive that comes out of disaster it’s that. Courtney, what are the things that you and your peers need right now?
CE: We often do work that some of the typical galleries don’t or won’t show. I feel like the storm has provided me with the chance to get my foot in the door on the gallery row area. But still there are a lot of barriers to showing work in this city that isn’t easily consumed or easy to buy.

Courtney Egan
Soft Spots (2008)
Video installation
|
NS: Is that because of a quantitative lack of exhibition spaces or because New Orleans galleries drift more toward an aesthetic that’s… more commodifiable to a local audience?
CE: Well, they have to sell work. I don’t think there are many collectors—especially who are willing to buy things that are a little out of the box. And that’s because there’s not much money in our city. It goes back to a need for the city and the whole region to have some sustained economic development that will eventually trickle down to the arts. The people who work like I do definitely lack spaces to show our work and it’s a huge issue. The other area of need is some sort of media access center. People need to be able to share their stories. There are very few places to go to and learn about media and put your story on tape. Some sort of long-term story project would be a great thing for the city.
JG: Even though the sale of art is usually framed as a financial issue, a lot of it comes down to education and what people’s knowledge base is for the idea of collecting and what they see as collectible. That’s another thing we’re going to address at Louisiana Artworks in the context of flat-files: works on paper that people would be able to purchase—small works that would be inexpensive but would allow collectors to start to nurture young artists.
RB: I think what’s happened is that different constituencies are coming together. For me, that’s been rewarding; people are now able to talk about cutting-edge issues like non-traditional ways and spaces to show art. There was a young group of graduate students at the University of New Orleans that just decided to go out and do a show. They went out and found a space and did it. That spirit had gotten lost and we had that spirit—I guess I’ll reminisce a little—back in the early CAC days when I was an undergraduate. That’s how the CAC started: a group of artists got together and said, “We need to have a place to show our cutting-edge work,” and they found that space. I see that spirit coming back again, which I’m really happy to see.
JG: There are a lot more people who have taken an interest in New Orleans. People are willing to come here now. I know it’s a strange positive, but it is something that’s come out of the situation.
RB: And something that makes New Orleans special is the grassroots. Neighborhood organizations, Social Aid & Pleasure Clubs, Mardi Gras Indians… art forms that have developed at a local level that have influenced us all. To get in touch with what they mean to us now is important. For those of us who were in the neighborhoods before, we knew how important the Mardi Gras Indians were. Darryl Montana is going around the country talking about his art form. Now, across the country people are seeing the Mardi Gras Indian art form and looking at its value as an art form. That’s really significant.
NS: I want to ask Allen a question about economics and design. There’s less space in New Orleans that’s habitable right now so it’s become more expensive. From a design point of view, how has this issue been dealt with historically and what are some New Orleans-specific solutions that could or should be implemented to deal with the situation?

Eskew+Dumez+Ripple
Areial view of Riversphere Master Plan
New Orleans
|
AE: The resilience of the city is something I’ve become very interested in. There’s a body of literature by writers and urban designers—this is totally before the storm—who have been looking at natural disasters, wars (especially WWII) and many of them talk about the DNA of a city, or how to repair a city while still being respectful of its original DNA. That’s sort of where my work is going.
Since the storm I’ve gotten very interested in how to describe, in positives, the question of New Orleans spirit and authenticity and funk. Certainly there’s a New Orleans sound, cuisine, performance art (especially the Mardi Gras Indians and local rituals and dancing). This is our DNA. The contemporary visual arts scene, which I love to follow, is trying to find its legs. Architecturally we’re trying to find our legs in the recovery, and my greatest fear is that the recovery is “replica recovery.” That community and business leaders have been seduced by soft, neo-traditional replacements, thinking that the way to the future is through the past. The authentic is the authentic, and we have to find a way to recover without being fake. For me that’s a trick bag right now. When people are hurting and trying to get back into their house, talking about the appropriateness of shutter detail… Put it this way: if our city were a medical patient it would be in the emergency room. Sometimes architecture-as-object is not as critical as healing neighborhoods. I try to advocate healing without losing the funk because that’s what we were about before the storm, in all of our neighborhoods, across racial lines. New Orleans is one of the more unique places in the country. If in our recovery we lose our soul—architecturally and otherwise—then I think that’s a huge tragedy.
NS: I was walking on Decatur Street this morning and I saw these signs reading “BLANK SLATE 2008.” A truly blank slate would seem to disregard the funk you’re talking about.
RB: The concept of “authentic” is a moving target that changes and gives and takes and evolves. We’ve all changed and the world’s changed, and how we incorporate those changes into who we are as people is a significant factor.
AE: None of us ever imagined living in the absolute epicenter of the largest natural disaster in the history of our birth country. It’s like a fantasy game. All of a sudden we had to ask ourselves, “Do I go or do I stay?” Well, we’re all here. Going into year three, there’s a real sense of optimism. I’m not sure I would want to be anyplace else. While it’s totally weird and unpredictable, it’s like we’re in a live, active Petri dish.

Ron Bechet
Reality Is Illusion (2007)
Oil on shaped panel
|
NS: Within this Petri dish that is contemporary existence in New Orleans, is the experiment for New Orleanians only? How are people from out of town received and does the art community want them here? Joy, you moved here a few years ago. What has your reception been like and what kind of challenge has it been to integrate yourself into the New Orleans art community?
JG: Listen, Nick, I want to hear what they say first. (Laughter)
RB: We’ve had people come in and it’s been a mixed bag—some really great and some not-so-great experiences. It depends on the motives of the individual that comes.
NS: What have been some of the motives that you’re experienced firsthand?
RB: For example, we had a group of students come in to Xavier from two schools. They wanted to help us with some of our studio problems; getting junk and trash out. At the same time there was another group of students who were more voyeurs than anything else. They didn’t have a genuine understanding of what we were going through. They wanted to see if they could take back what we were throwing on the curb!
AE: Back in the Ellis Island days, New Orleans was the second-largest immigrant point of entry. I’ve recently started observing that the storm has initiated the second major immigrant movement in New Orleans. There’s been an intellectual migration: university art professors and also the creative class. And youth. It’s the brightest, best group of outsiders I’ve ever seen come into the city on their own. The third immigrant group isfrom Latin America. This question of immigration is going to be a great thing to ask 20 years from now in New Orleans.
RB: I tell you what, it’s wide open now.
AE: The young people don’t care about social caste crap. They come in and look at it for what it really is, which is fictitious reality. They treat it as theater.
NS: Is there a danger in people interpreting New Orleans as theater? Can that make it so the reality of what happened never quite sets in?
AE: Somebody said that the flood lifted the veil of institutional racism; of a class system; of a dichotomy between working class and old, conservative money. I think the flood peeled that back and all of our children will be better for that purging. Sure, there will be some unfortunate translations and bumps in the road, but the future of New Orleans in the summer of 2005 was absolutely questionable.

Courtney Egan
Deep Water Marker (2007)
Documentation of ArtInAction public art action
New Orleans
|
CE: It does seem like the people who are here now are people who really want to be here. There’s no other reason to be here. (Laughter)
NS: Courtney, do you personally feel protective of New Orleans, like it’s turf for the locals? People coming from more affluent parts of the country may have more money and be able to more easily afford the scant space that is available in New Orleans. This is the essence of gentrification.
CE: These are definitely issues for people; especially people who haven’t been able to come back. But I’m not protective of the city. I also think people are very happy to have visitors come and see what the city is really like. Right after the storm… I heard a member of the Soul Rebels Brass Band put it this way: he said the media dissected the city in a way that was very disturbing and painful for New Orleanians. That intense dissection and the stories that came out of it need to be countered with other stories.
NS: So, Joy, what has your experience moving to New Orleans in 2006, after the storm, been like?
JG: I came here because I thought getting involved with policymaking and to have an effect in New Orleans through the arts was one of the most exciting things to do, ever. When I was in New York I was involved with politics. I was involved with waterfront development. I was involved with a community of artists. I had been doing that for 10 years already and was looking to leave, so the idea of possibly getting that here was attractive. I feel like I’ve had to break down a lot of barriers. I find that there are social structures that I was warned about over and over; that I would not be accepted, that I would have to be patient for that warming-up to occur. But I didn’t really feel that. Maybe I just wasn’t too affected by cynicism and was very self-motivated to help. I think the people coming to New Orleans now have to have that spirit. After all, this is a frontier. The kinds of challenges that you face here are fantastic.
AE: Eighty percent of our community, probably for the rest of my lifetime, is going to be a Mad Max mindscape, with pockets or hamlets that survive and flourish almost under self-determination. I think it’s going to be the new reality.
I certainly welcome and am enthused about people moving to New Orleans because they raise the level of conversation artistically and architecturally. I make the distinction between people who come to engage versus people who come to exploit. The Halliburtons and multinational political suppliers that were here to strip-mine the relationships—whether they’re consultants or service-providers or politicians, it’s the politics and economy of tragedy—there’s a huge economy there. These people chase storms all over and make enormous amounts of profit and political gain; I don’t have much tolerance for them.
JG: A couple of newcomer I’ve met who have had successful previous experiences in their lives have come here and tried to transfer that experience, and it’s not transferrable. You’ve got to live this experience.
CE: There is some “art carpetbagging” going on; people who have their own agenda and come down to try to execute it.

Eskew+Dumez+Ripple
Proposal for
"Make It Right" home in New Orleans' Lower 9th Ward
|
NS: What are those agendas?
RB: I think it entails something very simple: personal gain. Not community gain. We’ve had some people come in who seemed to ask, “How can I get a body of work from this?” Or, “What can I mine from this?” rather than, “How can I assist an artist in some way?”
CE: I’ve had great experiences with the opposite, too. People who have been so benevolent who have come down to help—people like Paul Chan.
AE: One thing I love is having firms from outside the city be given the same exact brief as we’ve been given and have such a diversity of response.
CE: What were the differences you found between the local and national entries for Brad Pitt’s project with the pink houses?
AE: I think there were five local entries. There were differences between them; we were not monolithic. I enjoyed seeing the international contestants look at New Orleans and make fresh, contemporary statements. Some of the locals made very safe translations. You can be safe to a point where it’s being merchandisable. I was seeing an even more conservative resistance at the neighborhood level, and a friend who is a family counselor pointed out that when people have death or loss or grief it’s often a time when they become most conservative. It helped me to understand some of the local responses, contextually.
NS: This touches on something you were talking about, Ron. Also Allen and Courtney; it sounds like each of your work became less conservative, and what I mean by that is that it not longer adhered completely to the values that were yours before the storm. Those were things you all said you dispensed of, which seems like a non-conservative response. Courtney, your work has become very public—not just as an individual but also your work in community organizing and getting the community’s art out there. Making a collective body of work available and public seems integral to what you’re doing now.
CE: I think Ron said what I also feel about working alone in the studio. It felt pointless and disconnected after the storm. The most important thing became making connections, hearing about people who are making films, visiting with local voices, and getting their stories. Seeing what they were discovering and finding was a way for me to re-connect, to rediscover myself in this city after the storm. Sharing them just felt like something I could do.
I went through a real crisis after the storm in terms of the purpose of art. I was asking myself the classic question: What’s the point of doing this? What value does it have in the community? Doing this sort of work was an outgrowth of questioning art itself. Eventually it started finding a way back into my own practice. It’s a wonderful thing to see work being made about how the city is changing, and I think at some point—10 years down the road—there’s going to be an amazing collection of New Orleans after-the-storm work about all aspects of recovery.
AE: In a different way, our firm asked ourselves the same thing you did, Courtney. When the storm hit, all of a sudden we were doing things that would never have passed our portfolio review before, so I’ve had to do some mentoring of the young people at the firm to explain why we’re working on some projects and explain that the linkage is not the end product but that we’re doing some projects because it’s the right thing to do, that the process is more important than the product.

Courtney Egan
Passing (2006)
Video on car door
|
CE: It becomes more about content than form.
AE: Absolutely.
RB: A significant part of my effort since the storm has been to understand who I am as a world citizen and a citizen-artist. I’ve been going back and looking at Goya’s “Caprichos” series and works that were significant in their time, works that affected others.
AE: Do you find that as an active artist your work is more meaningful to the community now?
RB: I find it difficult to answer for the community. I think that our community knows what I do now and they understand why I do it.
JG: There’s a lot more attention on artists now.
AE: I’ve observed that visual and performing artists are more visible now to a wider range of people. Just the act of bringing contemplation or visual joy to the trauma of healing is a very positive thing. There’s a wider audience; more people are coming out to events, even when they don’t know why.
NS: Is the increased interest in New Orleans’ arts community after the storm attributable to this thirst for collectivity that happens in the aftermath of trauma?
CE: I think it might have been out of necessity, too. Especially right after the storm, art became a way to see people and communicate with people you hadn’t seen in a long time and also to find out who had a washer and dryer working that day or find out whose home is gone but wants to go out and play music that night.
AE: I don’t think if we were all accountants and lawyers we’d be sharing the same observations. I think the general community out there has been interested in coming and watching the artistic community evolve.
JG: And deal with…
AE: And take it in and absorb it.
JG: What does art represent? In our culture? In any culture? Art is reflective and “contemporary.” It’s a reflection on the current.
NS: And it can be evocative—spontaneously evocative—of situations and environments in ways that accounting, for example, can’t.
RB: I evacuated to Houston after the storm and Houston for me was this vast land of homogenization. You go ten blocks and see… how many Starbucks? The same thing over and over again. Strip malls. In some ways it’s an architectural nightmare.
AE: (Groaning) Houston!
RB: But one night I went to a place called the Red Cat in Houston and Rebirth was there, a New Orleans brass band. It was such an amazing experience. Not only was it Rebirth but it was all these people…
AE: The tribe! The tribe gathered in the Houston wilderness.
RB: And it became real again. It became not only real again, but not just an intellectual exercise. It became that narrative, that story, that content. It brought me to tears. My heart sang because a connection was made again. And it was not just the band but the collective, the people around it—everybody dancing and knowing those sounds. It was about the heart, not just the intellect. Obviously we need the two, but the heart is important. It was a significant moment in the middle of my exile.
JG: To flip back to what we were referring to earlier, art demarcates history. It is the thing that we look to for reference points. It is that paradigm.
CE: I think being here makes one more interested in art as an experience, too. I’ve been feeling that sense of community more in an art context than I ever did before.
AE: It’s interesting to think about “content” as you’re using the word, Ron. In my studio, a language has evolved where we talk about “content, design, and delivery.” I’m trying to find a way to make visual on our website and in our portfolio “content” that entails going to a neighborhood and working with it to help facilitate their recovery. It brings great joy and satisfaction but at the end of that you don’t have a product. But I think it’s good.
RB: New Orleans has always been about that content; it’s a special thing about New Orleans. Narrative, story… what we may call Southern flavor. You always find a good storyteller here, and I think that translates in all of our art forms—that ability to understand story and content.